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Thread: Conservatives Against MADD

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    Administrator Former Board Member Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha's Avatar
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    Conservatives Against MADD

    I think this helps with our arguments that opposition to MADD isn't confined to just one end of the political spectrum:
    (STILL) MAD ABOUT MADD [Andrew Stuttaford]
    http://corner.nationalreview.com/05_...ive.asp#078969


    Radley Balko gives a well-deserved thrashing to MADD, an organization that started out with the best of intentions (and in response to a real social problem), but which has now mutated into something bullying, malevolent and repellent. Correctly, Radley draws attention to the possibly dangerous consequences of a reduction in the upper blood/alcohol limit to 0.8, as well as its absurdity:

    “MADD's biggest victory on this front was a nationwide blood-alcohol threshold of .08, down from .10. But when two-thirds of alcohol-related traffic fatalities involve blood-alcohol levels of .14 and above, and the average fatal accident occurs at .17, this move doesn't make much sense. It's like lowering the speed limit from 65 to 60 to catch people who drive 100 miles per hour. In fact, the U.S. Government Accountability Office reviewed all the statistical data and concluded "the evidence does not conclusively establish that .08 BAC laws by themselves result in reductions in the number and severity of crashes involving alcohol."

    And then there’s this:

    “MADD is also pushing its agenda onto family laws, including a zero tolerance policy for divorced parents. Under the bills MADD is trying to push through state legislatures, a parent caught consuming one beer or glass of wine before driving could face penalties that, according to MADD, "should include, but are not limited to" — "incarceration," "change of primary custody," or "termination of parental rights." This means that if you take your kid to the game, have a beer in the third inning, then drive home, you could very well lose your rights as a father.”

    Connoisseurs of such matters will note (sorry, Ramesh), the way in which ‘the children’, those Trojan ponies of adult freedom, are, as usual, brought into the argument.

    But then comes the final kicker. The taxpayer – that’s you and me – is subsidizing this nonsense. MADD is entitled to its degeneration into a neo-prohibitionist clique, but not, surely, on our dime.

    “Unfortunately, the tax-exempt organization has become so enmeshed with government it has nearly become a formal government agency. MADD gets millions of dollars in federal and state funding, and has a quasi-official relationship with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. In some jurisdictions, DWI defendants are sentenced to attend and pay for alcoholic-recovery groups sponsored by MADD. In many cities, MADD officials are even allowed to man sobriety checkpoints alongside police.On the occasion of its 25th anniversary, perhaps its time Congress revisit the spigot of federal funding flowing to MADD, and consider revoking the organization's tax-exempt status. Clearly, MADD isn't the same organization it was 25 years ago. It has morphed into an anti-alcohol lobbying organization. There's nothing wrong with that — it's certainly within MADD's and its supporters' First Amendment rights.But taxpayers shouldn't be forced to subsidize them.”

    I’ll drink to that.


    Posted at 02:03 PM
    “But let it be considered, that he did not mean a real and generous love of our country, but that pretended patriotism which so many, in all ages and countries, have made a cloak of self-interest.” - James Boswell

    "How did the party of Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman and John F. Kennedy drift so far from the foreign policy and national security principles and policies that were at the core of its identity and its purpose? . . . A great Democratic secretary of state, Dean Acheson, once warned 'no people in history have ever survived, who thought they could protect their freedom by making themselves inoffensive to their enemies.' This is a lesson that today's Democratic Party leaders need to relearn." - Joe Lieberman

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    Youth Rights Deity Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe has a reputation beyond repute Anduwaithe's Avatar
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    Actually, I was under the impression that conservatives were the end of the spectrum most against MADD.
    Ken
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    Administrator Former Board Member Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha has a reputation beyond repute Yasha's Avatar
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    That makes sense, yes. But the impression amongst many, if not most, youth rights supporters is that opposition to MADD is a liberal-libertarian thing. So I'm posting this to show how wide the spectrum of opposition really is.
    “But let it be considered, that he did not mean a real and generous love of our country, but that pretended patriotism which so many, in all ages and countries, have made a cloak of self-interest.” - James Boswell

    "How did the party of Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman and John F. Kennedy drift so far from the foreign policy and national security principles and policies that were at the core of its identity and its purpose? . . . A great Democratic secretary of state, Dean Acheson, once warned 'no people in history have ever survived, who thought they could protect their freedom by making themselves inoffensive to their enemies.' This is a lesson that today's Democratic Party leaders need to relearn." - Joe Lieberman

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    Ah, cool. Yeah, in Vermont, for instance, the Rep. who introduced the drinking age bill--and a majority of the co-sponsors, IIRC--were Republicans.
    Ken
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    "College is like an Irish marriage. After the honeymoon, it's just a lot of work and a lot of drinking." --Chip Sinton

    "Who could have predicted that building a fully-enclosed ski resort on the edge of the Persian Gulf might be a sign of a bubble economy?" --Josh Marshall

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    Youth Rights Deity Board Member SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille has a reputation beyond repute SciVille's Avatar
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    Yeah, it does make sense that conservatives would be most against MADD and such because the drinking age thing is a major violation of states' rights.
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    Youth Rights Deity Former Board Member Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke's Avatar
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    *nods* Yeah, I always thought liberals were the ones who were into a lot of protectionism, a la Hillary Clinton...
    I was dead, but I'm alive again, I think.

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    Youth Rights Titan Board Member why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18 has a reputation beyond repute why18's Avatar
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    It's hard to say. I think politicalcompass.org is right here, that there's a big difference between liberals and libertarians. Liberals and conservatives can be for protectionism and groups like MADD because liberal and conservative are really economic views.
    "Thanks for your e-mail and I appreciate the fact that you articulated your viewpoint in a rational and cogent manner. A few questions though, Stefan. Who are you voting for in the Presidential Election this November? Kerry? Bush? Oh, you mean you can't vote? Why is that? What kind of car do you drive? Ford? Jeep? Oh you mean you don't drive. Why is that? Why is that you can't just stay home for the rest of the year and not go to school? Why?"
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    Youth Rights Deity Former Board Member Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke has much to be proud of Fabuluke's Avatar
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    Yeah...*nods* But there are social liberals and conservatives too. It's not just economics, even though the terms originally applied to economic views.
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    grrr...i read the first coupla paragraphs, and i couldn't hold back my severe hatred anymore.

    I HATE THE WHORES AT MADD.

    on a worse note, we're studying MADD in history. im gonna bring up some good anti-madd points tommorow.
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  10. #10
    Youth Rights Knight CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts
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    A group like John Birch Society portrays MADD the same way as they portray anti-gun advocates.JBS believes that MLDA 21 Act of 84 is totally anti American.They dream to cripple MADD.

  11. #11
    Youth Rights Deity Board Member KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz's Avatar
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    Its funny, people paint MADD as whatever ideology they hate. When I talk to liberals who object to the drinking age, they blame it on "those damn right-wing conservatives in MADD" and when I talk to conservatives they talk about those "nanny-state liberals in MADD".

    Good to see the above blog entry though. I'll blog a response if I've got a free moment tomorrow.
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  12. #12
    Youth Rights Knight CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts CHICKENHAWK is infamous around these parts
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    If Madd will be deprived from tax exempt status for being caught on conspirasy
    and underage epidemic drinking their 21 law created.According to real facts under 21 drinkings became high then it was before 21 Act.More irresposible binge
    drinkings,more drunk driving deaths among 18-24 years old,more violent crimes
    due to that.Madd is the encourauger for making youth go drunk by their prohibitions.I support for tax exemption deprivation for two lobbies PETA and MADD.PETA for pouring donations in support of terrorist movements ALF and ELF.MADD for creating underage drinking epidemy with 21 laws,and becoming
    a movement willing to start new prohibition and more organize crime and corruption.

  13. #13
    Youth Rights Deity Board Member KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz has a reputation beyond repute KPalicz's Avatar
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    Chickenhawk, and everyone else, meander yourselves on down to One and Four where I discuss this: http://www.oneandfour.org/archives/2...ging_anti.html
    New on One and Four: Lots of new updates! Check out One and Four!
    Chip - Alex is a tool, a screwdriver we must use to screw the ageists

    There are 5 bullet points about writing letters to the editor, the longest one is about being concise. - Eric talking about a new draft of the chapter handbook.

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